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Bunker Improvements

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#21
hellreturn

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Regarding the SK rule.   I can't say whether it is a good Idea for all bunker servers.  I will say that all of the scenario's that people worried about when we discussed changing the rules on b1 never happened. There was certainly more drama involved in the discussion on whether or not to change the rule than there was on the server after the rule change.  That doesn't necessarily mean that everyone likes it.

 

 

My suggestion would be to increase spawn shield time. 4 or 5 sec spawn shield = effective against spawn killing.  If you keep rule admins would end up wasting time in enforcing rules and can barely play.  



#22
killjoy

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So here comes the Ignoramus alert ! ! ! - Woop Woop Woop "Ignoramus Alert" - But What the Frag is "Multi-Clanning" - Is this when you find a lot of people from the same "Clan" playing on the same team ? - I must admit that I do see that quite often when people come to our "Community of Friends" & play on our Servers - It can effect the balance of Teams - But things do have a habit of balancing themselves out - Without heavy handed intervention :-) ..........Of course It may well appear that a visitor to our Servers is being "Multi-Communities" ..........Is that a word :-)



#23
neurosis

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Think of it as belonging to several communities.  ;)


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#24
Bean

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Think of it as marriage. Most clans insist on monogamy: Only one spouse/clan. FA is like that. Others, like our community, allows bigamy: More than one spouse, or multi-clanning.
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#25
TheDragon

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@ Hell, thanks, but aren't those supposed to be reserved for 'donating' folks?  Besides I usually only hit f/a if the bunker servers are empty (rare lately) I apreciate the thought and will 'wait it out' next time :D

 

 

Also communities are different (and in my opinion) better than clan groups.  My time at gaming uk we had tons of folks in the community.  We had many clans that would play on the 16 servers we ran.  Yes, there would be occasional dustups but we had a spot on our forums where folks could 'state their case' and (quite usually) after folks had blown off steam a logical discussion would ensue and a consensus reached.  We had 2 upper level admins and several server admins/forum mods.  We'd promote from actions on the server (how I got drafted into the whole system in the early days of gaminguk).  Players begging for admin rights usually didn't qualify, but those that were always helping players, jumping teams to balance the server out or other similar actions usually either got noticed by the admins or were reported to us admins.  Same with forum participation.  

 

Bunker was a similar such community I found, (god is it a decade ago or so now?).  Folks weren't out for blood, but were out to have fun (isn't that what games are for after all?)  I developed friendships and did what I could to make it a better place to play.  One day someone said congrats, I had become a member (news to me) and a few months later I was promoted to bot sitter (forget the admin level on b5 but high enough to fix the stuck bots and such)  Again, wasn't something asked for, but a privilege granted for good service.  

 

I'm not sure what all happened in the 3-4 years I was of line (well on a crappy laptop with mega lag, nothing to game with) but a lot less activity now.  Folks are still arround, you see them occasionally on the forums and even on the servers from time to time.  We just need to give ourselves the proper kick in the pants to get out there and rekindle the fun we used to have here.

 

[edit]

ya know, was gonna answer the multi clan thing, but bean trumped me good with the marrage analogy.  

but i'll add a little bit from my experiance.

 

Some clans are uber anal.  You must do X, Y, and Z.  You can play on these servers but not those.  You can't talk to those folks.  (have no idea how to have fun some of them)

Others are more relaxed but you still must stick to some standards.

 

Gaming uk was a community with only a few rules.  If you wanted to sport a [GuN} tag you had to play nice and show a good face.  You represented all of us of the community.  You could color it any way you wanted (many took to national colors) (which led to some interesting national inter clan battles (russians vs germans and cross pond were some of the more interesting ones to memory)

If you were having a bad day (or just didn't feel like being a nice guy) you simply took of the tag until you could be a 'good guy' again.  The few rare times we had someone being abusive with our tag on were reported on our forums by other community members and usually got a sheepish appology from the offender (we all have our bad days, when I renamed myself to SnidelyWhiplash I was no longer the nice guy, nor an admin of the guk servers, just a player with a chip on his shoulder out to vent.)


Edited by TheDragon, 05 May 2015 - 11:03 PM.

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#26
killjoy

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All now perfectly clear - Multi Clanners are the Mormons of the ET world :-)



#27
TheDragon

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Not nessisarily Killjoy.  In wild west I was on =WW= (wild west dev team), [GuN} (gaming uk group playing wild west), and a team play clan.  I wore the apropriate tag for the case.  While most of the folks knew I was on the dev team of wild west, If I had my team tag on I was in 'match mode'.  The dev tag ment it was free to ask me about the mod or for help.



#28
<IoW> BECK

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Take this for what you will, as I represent the "competition" ;)

 

I am more interested in keeping the overall ET community strong for years to come.   Obviously you don't all play on my server, perhaps it doesn't appeal to you.   No worries - but it is clear that you all love Bunker and want to keep your servers and community strong.   I hope the best for you in this endeavor.    There were certainly several "lean" years at <IoW> too, and we've had these very same conversations.    One thing I am extremely grateful for is the strong band of dedicated members that I have that keep the lights on and keep things going.  Without them, there is no <IoW>.

 

Here is my advice:

1. Get rid of spawn killing rules.  Honestly, we have no rules on SK, and it is NEVER a problem.   Yes, every once-in-a-while I get backraged by some defender coming out of spawn.    But 98% of the time there is no abuse of the areas around the spawn.  OF course, the term "abuse" is subjective, but in my opinion having no rules on SK has very rarely led to a team getting completely camped and unable to make any progress.     It just might remove the fear from people that they're going to bring down the wrath of the administrators if they do happen to kill someone around spawn.    In all honesty, if I came to your server I would be constantly afraid of breaking some sort of rule and getting yelled at.   At <IoW>, we have rules too, but the only people we yell at are hackers and people who completely ignore team-based play (e.g. medics need to heal dammit!).   Of course abuse of spawns may be more prevalent when you have 12v12 and a big messy war going on.  But ask yourself this: when it is 4v4: all Bunker members and a public, do harsh SK rules really matter 90% of the time?  But I know this is a long debated and sensitive issue around here.  My advice: get rid of SK rules.

 

1.a.  Create a spirit of teamwork and objective play.  Perhaps you already have this, but without teamwork and a willingness to work for objectives, then you're going to have those rambos who push the spawn just to rack up big numbers and feel good about themselves.    

 

2. Without people who actually want to play, you are doomed.   We have people in our clan who are long time members who play this game every single night.    Luckily, we have three or four of these type of people who can almost always be counted on to get things rolling and hopefully draw in some regulars or even publics.   

 

3. Someone suggested this earlier.  I totally agree:  Pick a night -- Make it Saturday or Sunday or whatever.  Make that your community night.  <IoW> has been doing this for Friday since our beginnings in 2005.   In the early days, Friday was password protected, clan practice for TWL.   It morphed into just more of a weekly event open to all.    I have my wife trained to know that I play ET with my friends on Friday night.  No other plans!    That is what I do, that is what a lot of our members do and we make it the highlight of the week.   Friday is the night, everything is about preparing for Friday, and Friday is usually when we have a full server.  

 

4. Focus on nurturing and catering to your existing community.  It's 2015!  The game is 12 years old!    Don't expect a bunch of new people to show up, they are few and far between.   Don't run your server and make rules as if it is 2004.  Does that make sense?  I can't really explain what that means honestly...but I "know" what it means.   The game has matured, and so should our attitude about it.

 

5. How many servers does Bunker have?  Why?   It seems like you're trying to fill up 4 or 5 servers when you could probably be focusing on 1.    I realize Bunker is global and people have ping issues etc...I think you've also got some camps of people who like this mod over that mod and classic maps verses custom maps or rotations verses voting.   These are all tough issues to reconcile.   I know whatever decision you make may end up alienating one camp or another.   I only have one server to configure, and it makes life much easier.     Maybe you need to do a roll call?  A reset?   Any Bunker members who still care, we're going to make one server that has "X" Mod with "Y" Maps, but still has the Bunker feel and rules.   Either play or don't, but no more nurturing of 4 different servers for a dozen active people.    Maybe I'm out of line?   But this is what I see an as complete outside observer.

 

Anyway - I really do hope the best for Bunker.    You have all always been great people, and I think we all share a similar philosophy for how ET should be played.   It would be shame to see yet another great ET community die out.


Edited by <IoW> BECK, 07 May 2015 - 03:37 PM.

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#29
G0rt

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We (I) appreciate the feedback Mr. Beck.  It does open things up to ponder some changes.  Thank you



#30
Bean

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Crazy ideas:

1) Consolidation down to two servers: Bunker America and Bunker Europe. Or maybe just one: Bunker Infinity.

2) Every Bunker server has new rule: Spawnkill with anything and everything.

3) Induction of four new members into the AF, to bring new ideas and more time to put into effect these ideas.

4) Formal amalgamation with another community in a similar situation. Complete with rebranding / new name. Something like "The Armoury." You know, the bunker where you keep your instruments of war! |<A>|

I know, I know. Whoa!

#31
Jecoliah

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Crazy ideas:

4) Formal amalgamation with another community in a similar situation. Complete with rebranding / new name. Something like "The Armoury." You know, the bunker where you keep your instruments of war! |<A>|

I know, I know. Whoa!

 

We might as well just close up shop and all go join F|A, LOL, that is where all the players are.

J/K  :laugh2:

 

 

 

Jec



#32
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Okay...

 

Not sure if I can make this short... or if it will solve the problem... but here is my opinion either way.

 

1) Multi-Clan:  I am, and have been, a member of several ET groups BUT... my first loyalty and the tag I proudly wear where-ever I play is my Bunker identity.  Becoming part of the other communities gives you privileges visitors don't get which is the primary reason I signed up.  To date I have had no problems being part of multiple communities/clans.  I have been asked by some F|A members if I was interested in taking on some Admin responsibilities and I graciously declined adding I would re-consider if my home server ever closes up shop.

 

2) I love the ideas QT and others came up with months ago about server sitting etc.  The downside to this is my work hours are not consistent and it's very difficult for me to commit to specific times to play.  Weekends are always better for me, so the Saturday or Sunday regular game works most of the time.  However my wife and I are traveling more visiting kids and their families or just having a little fun.  I have, and will continue to try to pull together a frag party once a month.  Week days for me are tough and the only server I can find populated when I can play is F|A... but as I've said before, I always stop by the website to see if anyone is playing on our servers first.

 

3) Rules: I'm open to any and all rule changes with one exception. I do not think that making Bunker players play only on our servers is a good idea.  Spawn-kill or any other option are open for change if it will bring in more players.  When I have time to play this game... I want to play right then.  If F|A is the only server with real people playing... that's where I'm going to go.  I'm always willing to leave the F|A server if one of ours is filling up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So come and get me... please.

 

4) Maps: There are very few maps I don't like and I will play all maps. However I will go spec if there is a "knife only fight" like most people play on that goofy Monkey Island. I will play the knife only Basketball map. My favorite maps are the epic, big, long, maps like the MLB Sunrise etc.  The longest map they play at F|A is Venice and they don't play it often.  I like map voting as well.

 

Most week nights I can't play until about 7-7:30 CT and sometimes later depending on work.  Weekends are usually open but I still don't have the kind of life where I can commit to play on any day, at any time, all the time. 

 

I'm not sure about a frag party for May yet... I'm still working on clearing my "honey do" list, which is really long.  I'll post as soon as I figure it out. 

 

I really like playing with my Bunker friends the best.  They know what team play is all about and most are objective oriented.



#33
neurosis

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My advise would be to get rid of some of the politics that control the servers. It sucks to have to fight for a rule that only affects a single server when you are fighting people that don't even play on that server.  We lost a significant number of people over that.

 

It took too long for jec to make decisions that should have been made a year prior due to politics. (to no fault of his own)

 

I also agree with Beck.. In the end, there will only be one server standing eventually. Why spread it out.

 

Someone is going to have to start making some decisions at some point.. it feels as if the AF doesnt even work together anymore. Everything is an uphill battle. Be damned the servers they are administrating.

 

edit:  This is only coming from the point of view as a member playing on B1. Take it for what it is worth.


Edited by neurosis, 08 May 2015 - 05:53 AM.

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#34
killjoy

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We are a World Wide community & unfortunately although ( Up until Five years ago when I got a different job ) I was more than willing to put up with abysmal ping for a Euro player on |>B<|1 - ( When I was more able to cope with the lifestyle of a night owl ) - A lot of players positively dislike the inherent disadvantages of playing on a Server with poor connection - It had crossed my mind that we should pool our collective resources into One Server - But it will always disenfranchise one group of players - Depending on which side of the Big Pond we reside - Can the Single "Bunker Server" be moved or Directed between different geographically located Servers according to the time of Day ?

 

Three Servers for the Bunker Admins under the sky,
Seven for the Moderators in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Members doomed to die,
One for the Noob on his dark throne
In the Land of Bunker where the Shadows lie.

 

ONE SERVER TO RULE THEM ALL, ONE SERVER TO FIND THEM,

ONE SERVER TO BRING THEMN ALL AND IN THE DARKNESS BIND THEM.

In the Land of Bunker where the Shadows lie.



#35
neurosis

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Obviously most of these ideas will never happen.  They just look good on paper.  There are too many conflicting ideologies to combine the servers in to one.  Bots, no bots, sk, no sk, location............  

 

Who decides which server stays and which goes...  Its easy to look at it and say "its better to have 15 people on 1 server than 5 people on three" .  At this point, trying to combing the servers would probably do more harm than good.

 

We've watched some of the other bunker servers disappear in the past and that is what I suspect will happen in the future.


Edited by neurosis, 08 May 2015 - 06:15 PM.


#36
QuQu

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Just play. When ever u have time.  General improvement :)

 

But maybe...

I play some other places too time to time. One of the "all time full" place (just 40 slots) , uses strategy to give tag and membership pretty easy.

After 5..10 times playing there i got invited . Not interested tho.

Can it be option for B to gain more ppl playing regular  ?  

It might be not too bad option . Usually u can tell with in a week who is who. Surprises exist for sure :) 



#37
neurosis

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I love your attitude Qu.  let it work itself out. 



#38
*CapTn*

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clear up the anomosity u have amoungst memebers..

 

i have  fought the good fight now i sit and let  everyone else speak.

 

everytime i come here and try to help i get into a fight and that isnt my et.. at all. so yeah i dont care.. i have  placees to play.  i said the changes would kill b1 and they did.now u can make up a any thing u want to tell me im worng but .. blah..

 

 

majority rules voting doesnt work.. wheres your majority now..

 

 

i would show up anyday bunker has people playing.. even tho i have had a lot of hills to climb only to be pushed off a cliff i still love me some bunker  and always call this home.

 

 

i think alot on how to imporve bunker but i refrane from coming to bunker so i dont have to fight it out..IM EVEN REFRANING IN THIS POST ..

 

i agree with hellreturn on loyalty.

 

and beck is spot on..great post beck.. and i understand everything u said hell.

 

this is a great topic i love bunker..



#39
solewu

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Shutting B1 or B4 down is no option as they are our main servers atm at each side of the pool.

 

Shutting B10 down makes no difference because it has a particular bot only type of player attraction.

 

Shutting B2 down should have happened a long time ago, I'm sorry for the b2 folks but it's dead. The former glory is gone.

 

 

I have always said less rules is better (less is more).

 

All you probably need is a general policy on how to behave (like no racism, insulting, abusing, teambleeding).

 

More rules make stuff more difficult and annoying while all you want is to have some fun.

 

Same like politics in Belgium lol, they just make rules for the sake of rules, nobody gets happier with it.

 

 

I know there are a huge amount of maps around and occasionally i like to play a new one..

 

But I always like the old ones the most (siwa oasis, supply, fuel dump, gold rush, wurzburg radar, rail gun, battery, venice, ...) and I think a lot of people do too.

 

These are the maps that make me want to play the most honestly.

 

 

Unfortunately due to the fact I live in China atm (where it's almost impossible to play due to ping, lag, time difference, lack of spare time in general etc) I am invisible on the servers.

 

And when I'm back in Belgium for a week or two i'm usually spending time with friends or i'm in another country again to travel. 

 

 

Best Regards,

Sol

 

 

 

P.S. Captn, Send me ur 'refraned' ideas in pm. I'll reflect on them if u like ;)


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#40
TheDragon

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@ sol, it's not impossible to play from there.  One of my testers was from Austraila.  Hardest part was arranging test times with a 20 hour time zone spread.  Yes ping isn't great, but it's not impossible.  

 

[edit] or are you in a part with less than optimal internet services?  (for get how big and varied china is these days.)


Edited by TheDragon, 12 May 2015 - 12:12 PM.






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